Side Reins!

[HafDressage]

So I grew up in a very SRS school of training that emphasized proper lunging in connection with side reins. Over the past 5 years I've mostly boarded at H/J barns and really enjoyed it for the most. I've learned a lot from my H/J friends and definitely have a lot of respect for them.

NOW, all of that being said, I literally can not watch my H/J friends lunge horses for the most part. They either don't use anything but the line or more recently, I've seen something called a neck stretcher. So, to go on a rant... I really just need to say that unless the sole goal of lunging is burn energy off (or perhaps assess lameness), I really don't see any point to lunging without side reins at all. Further, I actually think the neck stretcher is particularly terrible. If the horse wants to bring their poll up, they can't without resistance. It's easy for them to be crooked and there is very little actual bit pressure that would even remotely mimic a true connection to the bit.

So, all of this to say that all the time I just want to scream SIDE REINS to everyone I see lunging.

https://www.horze.com/lunging/horze-adj ... rce=google

[Tsavo]

People who know what they are doing use properly adjusted side reins for lunging.

The neck stretcher looks whack.

[DJR]

I don’t use side reins when I lunge, except on occasion. I mostly lunge my 4 yr old to ensure that I have a brain between his ears before I get on as he was just backed late this summer. I use a lunging caveson, but it’s only seldom that I use side reins on him.

I wouldn’t use that neck-stretcher contraption ... not sure what it is supposed to accomplish!

[AmityBee]

So, all of this to say that all the time I just want to scream SIDE REINS to everyone I see lunging.

No. Thanks but no. I longe in a cavecon (the french kind not the vienna kind) or I long line. No side reins for my horse course he can not move in them. Never could, painfull to watch. It's like he's blocked at the whithers. It doesn't matter how long/short the reins are. I think he's afraid to "fall" (loose his balance). His head is down and the rest of him is just tense stiff and not working. Same thing in vienna reins. The only training aid that ever kind of worked for him is the pessoa training aid. I prefer the long lining though...

[mari]

Each to their own I guess. I think side reins are the devil and refuse to lunge in them

[khall]

I never use SRs anymore. Have not in years and do not miss them. I find I can do better work without them but I do so much WIH that my horses have quite a few buttons on them that I can access even on the longer lunge line to help balance them.

[Tsavo]

Lunging CAN be an extension of riding in terms of training correctly and building muscle correctly. But the only way it can do that is with side reins in my opinion.

In my horse's rehab, I did not use side reins because my main purpose was to assess his soundness. He would stay on his circle, never pull, take HHs, move his neck, etc. which was all good. But there is no way he was building muscle.

With a non-rehabbing horse, I would prefer to ride rather than lunge. But if I was lunging, I would use SRs to not allow lost ground on the muscle front.

[Ryeissa]

I don't like side reins much anymore, it creates too much backwards acting on the bars- I just don't think it's possible to keep the same dynamic feel with a static/somewhat elastic fixed rein.
I prefer sliding reins, no reins, or double longing/longlining.

[StraightForward]

I don't like side reins much anymore, it creates too much backwards acting on the bars- I just don't think it's possible to keep the same dynamic feel with a static/somewhat elastic fixed rein.
I prefer sliding reins, no reins, or double longing/longlining.

Same here. I see some cringe-worthy use of side-reins. I recently invested in some Lauffer (sliding) reins and use them sparingly. I also finally bought rigid-nosed serrata style cavessons, and would argue that, used properly, they can be quite effective without SRs, but the lunging achieves different objectives than lunging in a fixed SR.

Double-lunging is great. I always forget to do it for some reason.

Mostly, it seems few people put much thought into lunging - what they are trying to achieve, and if they are going about it the best way possible. This often results in a mish-mash mess of using it to burn off energy and the the SRs get thrown on to put the horse in a frame or whatever, but it's still zooming around recklessly and out of balance.

[Tuddy]

I'll toss my hat in here...

In my experience, every time I have witnessed lunging with side reins, the sole purpose was to put the horse "in a frame". I don't know why I would want to put my horse in a frame, but rather, would like my horse to find his frame/balance himself and carry it on his own. Make sense?

I am not really a lunging person to begin with, I have done it to give my guys exercise, and generally double lunge when I do.

But - as said above, to each their own, and I absolutely respect that.

[kande50]

The only reason I ever lunge is to introduce horses to something new (saddle, crupper, breeching, etc.), or to expose them to aspects of their environment I know they're going to want to see going both ways and at all 3 gaits. So when I lunge I make sure they're okay at The Other End.

[Ponichiwa]

So, my bias is always to have my butt in the saddle vs. longeing, but that's because I am a) lazy about carrying extra equipment around, and b) generally barn-time-limited on any given weekday.

That said. I like sidereins for green horses as a non-confrontational way to teach them the boundaries of an appropriate working outline and how to carry themselves when they hit some contact. They tend to learn pretty quickly that rooting or bracing really only works against their best interests when the reaction is dispassionate as well as immediate.

It can be hard to manage that lesson appropriately solely from saddle time on some horses (not all-- I have not found side reins to be very useful for horses with a tendency to curl).

[Ryeissa]

Longing in SR is harder than riding. I can't tell you how many people allow the horse to slow/drop the forehand. its so hard to keep them up and open in the side reins

At least undersaddle we have leg and can feel when the horse is falling/dying/weird/luggy

Also attaching SR to the girth is usually a really bad idea. it create a setup that has the bit work down/back on the bars. At least use a surcingle that gets the reins up on the top of the horse to keep the 'reins" more like the rider has them

I'm not saying that I would never use them, but I know how bad I can be at keeping the horse forward. I prefer sliding reins if I need something.

[Chisamba]

I use side reins although l do believe lunging is an under trained skill. I remember when USDF instuctors certification began, the top trainers and instructors failed lunging 101.

However I think correctly adjusted side reins are a lot kinder than hands, first they are consistent , second they allow the horse to take as much or as little pressure as they want, so they are more self educational than the most tactful human ever. If a horse spooks, the side reins do not grab, if a horse bucks, it only puts as much pressure as the horse does, humans just cannot be that controlled.

I gave seen people who scorn side reins for being too constricting ride as thought they are beating a drum, sawing wood, or conducting an orchestra.

What do I consider correct use of side reins? At a natural standing position thectein should just have no slack and be attached at approximately the height of the horses center. When trotted on a 20 m circle the rein will have a slight slack, if you spiral the hirse in to 15 m with correct bend, the horse will find contact in the outside rein, on a 10 m circle the outside rein will give sufficient contact ti shift the balance of the horse . Once the horse understands the rein gives balance, allowing them back to the 20 m circle encourages stretch to the contact .

I would never give a long lesson without the safety of sidereins therefore all my horses and all ot client horses learn this skill

[galopp]

The question is why people use s.r.. First always using a caveson, and then s.r. to them (properly adjusted to allow the horse to be in front of the vertical). And the horse learns half halts to remain in a proper bearing and connection. And then in trot (because walk and trot need bascule). The purpose is the more developing and even bend and balance w/o creating longitudinal flexion. Just working into a connection. And then they are removed and the horse is allows to go forward/down/out in walk (or in trot). They are a stage in training. (And for a rider working on their seat they allow a steady connection while the rider rides w/o reins to work only on themselves.)

[M&M]

What is double longeing?

[StraightForward]

What is double longeing?

Longing with two lines. One attaches to the outside of the caveson or bit, and then runs through the surcingle ring to create an outside rein. I've done it as shown in this image, but apparently the outside line is often brought around the tail instead of over the back.

[Chisamba]

Commonly called long lines, or long lining. In my experience

[demi]

I think of the above photo as double longeing. When I think of long lining, I think of the handler being behind the horse.

I like both double longeing and long lining and have done it with Rocky. It took some time to get her used the the lines touching her, especially in double longeing with the line around the tail.

For me, it is easier to keep Rocky up and in the contact when longeing with sidereins vs double longeing. In double longeing I found it very hard to keep her from going BTV. I use light nylon lines, but still the length makes a heavier rein. This might be more of a problem with a little, finer bodied horse than with a bigger horse.

[Chisamba]

I think of the above photo as double longeing. When I think of long lining, I think of the handler being behind the horse.

I like both double longeing and long lining and have done it with Rocky. It took some time to get her used the the lines touching her, especially in double longeing with the line around the tail.

For me, it is easier to keep Rocky up and in the contact when longeing with sidereins vs double longeing. In double longeing I found it very hard to keep her from going BTV. I use light nylon lines, but still the length makes a heavier rein. This might be more of a problem with a little, finer bodied horse than with a bigger horse.

if the handler is behind the horse its ground driving, perhaps its a linguistic thing, a not being american thing on my part

but i did google double longing and got a lot of religious stuff, and nothing to do with horses, and i googled long lining and saw a lot of people longing from the center in two long reins.

[musical comedy]

but i did google double longing and got a lot of religious stuff, and nothing to do with horses, and i googled long lining and saw a lot of people longing from the center in two long reins.

What search engine do you use? I don't get any religious stuff and lots of horse stuff. For starters:

http://www.eurodressage.com/2016/10/18/ ... ntre-stage

[Ponichiwa]

if the handler is behind the horse its ground driving, perhaps its a linguistic thing, a not being american thing on my part

but i did google double longing and got a lot of religious stuff, and nothing to do with horses, and i googled long lining and saw a lot of people longing from the center in two long reins.

Suspect it's a spelling issue. Double longeing/lunging will get you horse stuff. Double longing, not so much.

[Ryeissa]

yeah, that is double lunging dressage
If you are behind the horse its more ground driving. but same idea.


Yes, there are TWO SPELLINGS

Longing (US English, classical spelling) or lunging (UK English, informal US) is a technique for training horses, where a horse is asked to work at the end of a lunge line and respond to commands from a handler on the ground who holds the line.

[M&M]

Thank you all.

[Kyra's Mom]

I seldom if ever use side reins anymore. You can address alignment without them although it is really attention to detail type work. Last spring and early summer I did quite a bit of lunging (a couple times a week for no more than 20 min) as I couldn't do much riding due to my back. According to Straightforward who rode her August and Sept, she improved a lot from the previous time she rode her. Something was working. I do not allow her to fart around on the lunge line. It is for work and I work on having her go with proper bend/straightness and when that happens, she usually drapes her skeleton very nicely and goes 'on the bit' even though there isn't one. I also do lots of transitions on the LL. Some of them like halt-->rein back-->canter I still need the 'assistance' of the rail to keep her straight.

I use a Hybrid halter for my lunging now. That is a wonderful tool that I think has helped cultivate better alignment.

Susan

[khall]

Susan, do you do yields on the line to help with the alignment? I fully agree with you on lunging without SRs, not really needing them. It does take a good bit of dialog between lunger and horse in order to make changes, but since my horses all do in hand work a good bit I find that helps with our conversation on alignment when lunging. I also will sometimes step in and do a bit of "in hand" on the lunge line, close up work (with yields on the circle with bend being my favorite for balance) to help restore their balance then send them back out.

I have both double lunged and long lined though have never long reined like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMsjUNxhPgo

I actually prefer long lining with one line, goes back to my NH work. Just for broad work not precise work. WIH is still my basis for all of my work period.

[Kyra's Mom]

Yes, khall, I do Karen R's alignment exercise quite a bit. It is so cool to see them find straight. It is very apparent and at least my horse seems to enjoy it as it takes little effort to keep her there.

I too do a bunch of in-hand work or at least did until my foot said otherwise. I still do a little. I have been working on half steps with her sans equipment. I just use one whip at her chest as a barrier and one to tap her haunch and I can usually get some nice diagonal steps without any attachment. Not being able to ride a lot, the in-hand work is fun and rewarding for me (even if it isn't by THE book .

Susan