Insights from Jeremy Steinberg Clinic

[piedmontfields]

I just spent two days this week auditing a Jeremy Steinberg clinic with a variety of horses and riders. He is really an exceptional teacher! I let the clinic inspired and encouraged that the approach I was taking was, generally, very sound and more over *works*.

I will write up my clinic notes properly for the group, but wanted to share some initial enthusiasm and gratitude. He really helped me understand better why we work on gait development---not just movements, not just suppling. As he put it at one point (paraphrased), We can supple them to death, but do they get more powerful and more collected?? Not necessarily.

Had a fantastic ride on Emi this AM thinking about clinic lessons.

More to come!

p.s. To follow another thread, Jeremy commented at one point, Sure, a photo is a moment in time. But if most of the photos of a pair show something (undesirable), well, that's probably what is going on!

[piedmontfields]

Here is a first set.

Notes from Jeremy Sternberg Clinic

On Connection with a Difficult to Connect Horse

Connection is the first point of access for improving gait quality. Remember, dressage work is supposed to eventually lead to more collection and improved gait quality. Connection is the bridging of the body. If you don’t ride a hard-to-connect horse with power, they will never connect. I tend to do even more releases of the hand with strong horses.

With a naturally supple, mouth sensitive horse (ex. Lusitano), it’s the transition work and the release forward that will help them with thoroughness. Don’t worry about the transition quality as much as just DOING IT! Be blameless with contact—give the horse his neck so that you are not to blame. Don’t make them too round. You may need to think of riding them above the bit compared to where you were. This is the way to the hind legs.

There can be emotional and physical weight in the bridle. Just ride so many transitions (and releases) that the horse gets very light. The down transition to walk will become a half halt.

Think to yourself “I've got no issue with your neck, horse. I’ve got an issue with your back and hind legs.” Think of the horse’s neck and mouth as “You’re not involving me in that feeling.” Moreover, don’t get fixated on feeling. Pay attention to the overall shape and to balance. Sometimes we have to ride the shape, not the feeling.

With this type of naturally supple, round looking horse (Iberians), the overall top line shape is okay. We don’t have to make them rounder.

We want to get to the point that just the littlest tick on the rein can make a down transition. When you have this, you can add energy and ride forward. We want the horse to respect the hand, not run into it.

On any horse with a connection issue, you have to address balance in order to address connection. Remember, roundness is not always better! When the neck is braced, not hollow, ride through it and help the hind legs. Don’t discuss it in front (don’t try to “fix” the neck).

Log in lots of walk canters. Ride the horse’s back and use the transition to get to the hind leg. Let the transition do the work for you and keep lightening and letting go, using a tickle of the whip on the hind to help you. For trot-walk-trot, use the whip into the down transition (step under please) and let go! When you awaken the canter and if the horse runs into the hand, do a quick down transition to walk. Don’t engage with the mouth and neck. Then immediately canter again.

Log in lots of trot canters. I see PSG+ horses who can’t do these with throughness. For a horse challenged to connect, do 10-15 in each direction to bring the back to life.

Through your work, remember to not dumb the gaits down.

Remember, ride ability is the consistent established of basic reaction to aids, so that the horse responds consistently. To horses, challenges are less movement specific (“I have a problem with flying changes”) than about carrying the hind end. Movements are not a resolution to a problem. They are co-conspirators.

As the horse becomes more uphill and has more power, he becomes softer in the hand. In the collected canter, have the feeling that you could ride the hind legs under further still.

It is important to understand the difference of suppleness and thoroughness. Longitudinal suppleness does not dictate uphill balance or collection. Think of suppleness as left/right bending. Thoroughness *is* longitudinal.

When we ride transitions, it forces the back of the horse to work and to come to life—and to work correctly. In the down transition to walk from canter, touch the horse’s back leg with the whip to encourage him to step under (not dive into walk). Riding these transitions in an “abrupt” way will lead to a very nice half halt.

Remember, your horse could be very supple but never: Connect, Collect or be Powered Up.

To help with establishing connection, ride with one hand (non-dominant hand). By removing one hand, we tend to become steadier. See where the horse’s head goes. The horse will probably put it in their comfort zone. Horses need to have an escape zone—and that can be the head/neck. Try this in trot, in canter and for transitions. Then put both hands on the reins and try to retain the same quiet feeling, with hands close together.

[Rosie B]

Thank-you so much!! This is extremely timely. Lots to think about for sure.

[musical comedy]

Thank you Piedmont for superb notes. Do you still have the notes you wrote up from a JJ Tate clinic? Those were good notes. I made
some comments/questions in blue.


On Connection with a Difficult to Connect Horse

Connection is the first point of access for improving gait quality. Remember, dressage work is supposed to eventually lead to more collection and improved gait quality. Connection is the bridging of the body. If you don’t ride a hard-to-connect horse with power, they will never connect. I tend to do even more releases of the hand with strong horses.
Only makes sense. You can't collect energy you don't have.

Think to yourself “I've got no issue with your neck, horse. I’ve got an issue with your back and hind legs.” Think of the horse’s neck and mouth as “You’re not involving me in that feeling.” Moreover, don’t get fixated on feeling. Pay attention to the overall shape and to balance. Sometimes we have to ride the shape, not the feeling.
Hmm. Personally, I can't ignore what it feels like. There have been times in my lesson when I would say to my trainer "this
feels awful and would get told don't worry about it because it looks good".

We want to get to the point that just the littlest tick on the rein can make a down transition. When you have this, you can add energy and ride forward. We want the horse to respect the hand, not run into it.
Sounds good, but even the top bnts don't seems to be able to accomplish that.

On any horse with a connection issue, you have to address balance in order to address connection. Remember, roundness is not always better! When the neck is braced, not hollow, ride through it and help the hind legs. Don’t discuss it in front (don’t try to “fix” the neck).
I don't understand the 'not hollow' part. Is he saying to ride through (push through) a braced neck? I don't know. This sounds
like the theory that the hind end fixes everything. I'm not sure.

Log in lots of walk canters. Ride the horse’s back and use the transition to get to the hind leg. Let the transition do the work for you and keep lightening and letting go, using a tickle of the whip on the hind to help you. For trot-walk-trot, use the whip into the down transition (step under please) and let go! When you awaken the canter and if the horse runs into the hand, do a quick down transition to walk. Don’t engage with the mouth and neck. Then immediately canter again.
On which hind do you use the whip or does it matter? I guess if you have a horse that ignores a whip or doesn't accept one,
you are up a creek without a paddle.

It is important to understand the difference of suppleness and thoroughness. Longitudinal suppleness does not dictate uphill balance or collection. Think of suppleness as left/right bending. Thoroughness *is* longitudinal.
Suppleness is also longitudinal. Suppleness, or lack of it, is most apparent in down transitions.

When we ride transitions, it forces the back of the horse to work and to come to life—and to work correctly. In the down transition to walk from canter, touch the horse’s back leg with the whip to encourage him to step under (not dive into walk). Riding these transitions in an “abrupt” way will lead to a very nice half halt.
Again, which leg?

Remember, your horse could be very supple but never: Connect, Collect or be Powered Up.
Truer words were never spoken. That's why I complain about these long saggy reins and 'pleasant looking' horses that
are disconnected and lacking power.

To help with establishing connection, ride with one hand (non-dominant hand). By removing one hand, we tend to become steadier. See where the horse’s head goes. The horse will probably put it in their comfort zone. Horses need to have an escape zone—and that can be the head/neck. Try this in trot, in canter and for transitions. Then put both hands on the reins and try to retain the same quiet feeling, with hands close together.
Riding with non dominate hand? Never tried, but it would be epic fail for me I think.

[piedmontfields]

HI MC. Glad you enjoyed the notes. I will do another post on flying changes. I've put my comments to yours in another color

Only makes sense. You can't collect energy you don't have.

Yes, that's his POV.

Think to yourself “I've got no issue with your neck, horse. I’ve got an issue with your back and hind legs.” Think of the horse’s neck and mouth as “You’re not involving me in that feeling.” Moreover, don’t get fixated on feeling. Pay attention to the overall shape and to balance. Sometimes we have to ride the shape, not the feeling.
Hmm. Personally, I can't ignore what it feels like. There have been times in my lesson when I would say to my trainer "this
feels awful and would get told don't worry about it because it looks good".

This is hard for most people. It's kind of a case where you cannot trust feel! Every time I have seen Jeremy emphasize "poll higher" in clinics, the hind leg works better and the shape + overall balance is better---and there is more potential for real power. I suspect he would say this is just biomechanics---the horse needs to be in a poll position that permits energy to go all the way through. But don't quote me on that.

I was talking about this with a rider I know well and she commented that it is really hard for her to ignore a brace in the neck and focus first and primarily on the hind leg. When I pointed out how much better her horse went when she did that--and that the brace went away with that approach, she was still skeptical. I think she needs to look at the video! lol

We want to get to the point that just the littlest tick on the rein can make a down transition. When you have this, you can add energy and ride forward. We want the horse to respect the hand, not run into it.
Sounds good, but even the top bnts don't seems to be able to accomplish that.

Jeremy would probably agree. But he might also say that it simply isn't a goal for them. I do like a horse/ride like this so it makes sense to me, and I do think it is possible with most decently conformed horses.

On any horse with a connection issue, you have to address balance in order to address connection. Remember, roundness is not always better! When the neck is braced, not hollow, ride through it and help the hind legs. Don’t discuss it in front (don’t try to “fix” the neck).
I don't understand the 'not hollow' part. Is he saying to ride through (push through) a braced neck? I don't know. This sounds
like the theory that the hind end fixes everything. I'm not sure.

He is saying riding through the brace and focus on the overall shape. Usually the brace will go away. That said, he also emphasized that in some cases, you need to, for example, ride a horse a bit deeper through transitions to teach them not to brace (ex. walk-canter). But once in canter, ride them up.

Log in lots of walk canters. Ride the horse’s back and use the transition to get to the hind leg. Let the transition do the work for you and keep lightening and letting go, using a tickle of the whip on the hind to help you. For trot-walk-trot, use the whip into the down transition (step under please) and let go! When you awaken the canter and if the horse runs into the hand, do a quick down transition to walk. Don’t engage with the mouth and neck. Then immediately canter again.
On which hind do you use the whip or does it matter? I guess if you have a horse that ignores a whip or doesn't accept one,
you are up a creek without a paddle.

It does work on either hind, but for the down transitions the inside hind works well. He emphasized that training like this is why you teach a horse to accept a whip, and also do the work in hand to teach them to lift/lively up their hind legs in response to a whip. Horses without this education can react in a big way when you do this--but they do learn very quickly.

It is important to understand the difference of suppleness and thoroughness. Longitudinal suppleness does not dictate uphill balance or collection. Think of suppleness as left/right bending. Thoroughness *is* longitudinal.
Suppleness is also longitudinal. Suppleness, or lack of it, is most apparent in down transitions.

Jeremy emphasized typical suppleness work as mostly lateral. The longitudinal thoroughness (maybe you are calling that suppleness?) comes through the transition work with focus on the hind legs.

When we ride transitions, it forces the back of the horse to work and to come to life—and to work correctly. In the down transition to walk from canter, touch the horse’s back leg with the whip to encourage him to step under (not dive into walk). Riding these transitions in an “abrupt” way will lead to a very nice half halt.
Again, which leg?

In a trot-walk or canter walk, inside hind being extra awake can be helpful to avoid diving. But experiment!

Remember, your horse could be very supple but never: Connect, Collect or be Powered Up.
Truer words were never spoken. That's why I complain about these long saggy reins and 'pleasant looking' horses that
are disconnected and lacking power.

Yes, exactly, That very supple horse can be very pleasant looking and even pleasant to ride in a certain way. They just aren't powerful.

To help with establishing connection, ride with one hand (non-dominant hand). By removing one hand, we tend to become steadier. See where the horse’s head goes. The horse will probably put it in their comfort zone. Horses need to have an escape zone—and that can be the head/neck. Try this in trot, in canter and for transitions. Then put both hands on the reins and try to retain the same quiet feeling, with hands close together.
Riding with non dominate hand? Never tried, but it would be epic fail for me I think.[/quote]

Actually he said ride with the left hand (in either direction). But I think that was meant as non-dominant hand?. I am not super skilled or physically able and I found this super easy to do and quite interesting--especially looking in the mirror and seeing what zone my horse chose.

Note that these are my interpretations of his teachings! I highly recommend auditing a clinic if he is in your area.

[musical comedy]

That said, he also emphasized that in some cases, you need to, for example, ride a horse a bit deeper through transitions to teach them not to brace (ex. walk-canter). But once in canter, ride them up.

Ride a bit deep in up or down transition? I hope it was up transition. I say this because my horse got into the habit of wanting to dive down in downward transitions (my fault over the years). Just today in my ride, I was thinking about an old P. Karl video I saw. Karl was working with a green horse, and he would raise his hands way up and then quickly put them down. I tried this on my downward and my horse got the hang of it. Some horses are really smart if you are consistent. At this late stage of my and his life, I am still able to teach him (and me). He has to learn he can't seek support from me or fall on his face.

From your notes so far, Jeremy was addressing the more supple Pre type horse. Did he have anyone in the clinic that was a more heavy unsupple type like my horse?

I don't think Jeremy every comes to North East. I'm in NJ. Isn't Jeremy in California? I know he used to be in Washington State.

I saw on COTH that he charges $250. <sigh> I guess that is the going rate for bnt's these days.

[piedmontfields]

That said, he also emphasized that in some cases, you need to, for example, ride a horse a bit deeper through transitions to teach them not to brace (ex. walk-canter). But once in canter, ride them up.

Ride a bit deep in up or down transition? I hope it was up transition.

Yes, in the up transition (ex. walk-canter).

From your notes so far, Jeremy was addressing the more supple Pre type horse. Did he have anyone in the clinic that was a more heavy unsupple type like my horse?

Sorry, first set of notes focused on a horse like mine! Yes, there were various types. I'll try to sort through and add more ideas. I'm remembering that it was a situation of with the supple sensitive in the mouth horse, transitions are your friend. With the heavier, stiffer horse, bending is your friend.

I don't think Jeremy every comes to North East. I'm in NJ. Isn't Jeremy in California? I know he used to be in Washington State.

He is based in San Diego now, but travels all over the country and also to Australia I think. I know he goes to Maryland regularly. Look at this 2017 schedule here:http://www.steinbergdressage.com/dressage/Clinic_Dates_2017.html

He does charge the going rate for top trainers. Frankly, I think it is worth it for the quality of insight and direction. Of course auditing is incredibly reasonable as another option.

[Gwen]

I'm intrigued by the "littlest tick on the rein = down transition" - Callie is habitually behind the leg, and it has taken time to convince her that she should go forward into contact. She is sneaky about being behind the leg also so one of my early clues that she has gone there is that touching the rein results in a downward transition instead of a rebalance and feeling of "recycled power". Was this comment specifically for very forward minded horses, or is this something that would apply to all? And if to all, how would you maintain the forward and a steady contact?

[kande50]

Only makes sense. You can't collect energy you don't have.

I do think however, that we can get as much "collection" as the energy we have allows. But collection depends on a lot of other factors besides energy, so if we start right out trying to get more energy so that we can get more collection but haven't yet got all the other skills we need, then we just get tension and bracing. Which is exactly why I think that riding a horse forward into the hand is not the only answer, and may even be the worst one for some horses and riders.

We want to get to the point that just the littlest tick on the rein can make a down transition. When you have this, you can add energy and ride forward. We want the horse to respect the hand, not run into it.
Sounds good, but even the top bnts don't seems to be able to accomplish that.

And maybe that's because the down transition shouldn't come from the rein?

I guess if you have a horse that ignores a whip or doesn't accept one, you are up a creek without a paddle.

And that's when it's time to go back and reteach the horse what he needs to do in response to the whip (and possibly a lot of other cues/aids).

I think that going back and reviewing what I thought my horse knew is when I most often discover the holes that came out of our misunderstandings, which is why I go back often and take a fresh look at what I think my horse thinks. And when I do I'm often surprised at how just a tiny little tweak in how I explain it will make it so much clearer to him.

Remember, your horse could be very supple but never: Connect, Collect or be Powered Up.
Truer words were never spoken. That's why I complain about these long saggy reins and 'pleasant looking' horses that
are disconnected and lacking power.

True, but we also see many, many horses who are powered up and on a very firm contact that are disconnected too. The reason I favor "pleasant looking horses" is because I feel that the experience should be as pleasant as possible for the horses while their riders figure out the tact and timing that will allow them to get the kind of power and connection they want. And then, when they get it, they can start powering up to get more.

Riding with non dominate hand? Never tried, but it would be epic fail for me I think.

I was fortunate to run into an instructor way back when I was in college who pointed out the advantages of developing our non-dominate sides, and developing them in our horses, too. So I've been practicing that for 50 years now.

[piedmontfields]

More Notes from Jeremy Steinberg Clinic

Suggestions for Different Types of Horses and Training Challenges

Cob-Type Horse with Up-Down Hind Leg

This kind of hind leg can look very active, but we need to look at what kind of activity it is doing! With this sort of conformation, the hind can have a tendency to bounce up and down instead of supporting a swinging, reaching gait. Try using big sweeping lateral movements (ex. Leg yields) to get longer strides and to unwind the spind.

Behind the Leg or Sticky Feeling Horse

You have to program in the correct speed in front of you. This is establishing that basic “idle” or “cruising” speed for walk, trot and canter. We do not chase the horse with the leg to do this, but rather have a soft leg and use the whip to clarify GO. We don’t use the leg to sustain. Remember, with the hot horses, do not use the hands to hold them back—don’t fight with the mouth/neck. If the horse gets strong or charges off, do a quick transition to walk and then transition back up. Don’t fight in the walk and don’t worry about perfect transitions as much as doing the transitions.

The arc of the topine is the absorption point (top of the bow) for energy. The arc of the topline is also a point of potential energy as it bows up. We sometimes have to ride the shape over the feeling. When the body is the right shape and is working, the horse becomes softer and lighter (assuming basic conformation). In some cases, we have to set specific resistant walls to help them with the shape and the work (ex. Sometimes we do have to ask for more roundness).

On the whip and horse’s education: You should use the whip less over time, and when you do use it, it should be sharper. This teaches the horses that the consequences become sharper.

When you establish the idle speed for each gait, you are establishing muscle memory. For ex., when we trot, we do this trot, etc. With a young horse or a re-training situation, it can be okay to be very formulaic about the workload, for ex., we are cantering for 2 minutes at this idle speed.

Remember that walk is very hard for a horse to sort out: Are we working or are we relaxing? Be careful to be clear.

With young horses, their job is to learn to work consistently, with self-sustained idle speed. This takes years of quiet “cruising” and “motoring” under saddle. As soon as a young horse gets the idea, make it the standard and repeat it. This communicates “Now this is the way” and we expect that every time without fail.

Think of your warm-up as your “commute to work.” It needs to get you to work! Work involves a higher poll and pushing at engagement.

Notice if you are chasing your horse into a tight back. They may need to do work to loosen their back (ex. trot-canter-trot-canter) to move freely forward.

The Hard-to-Stretch Horse

Remember, that you might not be able to stretch them honestly that much. To keep the horse on contact and connected during a stretch, think of “stair-steppling” them down one inch lower, one inch out, very deliberately. This can be easier to control sitting than rising.

Don’t fixate on the stretch performance you think you need in a test. Be honest in the work.

Developing Self-Carriage

Think of the ballet dancer at the barre. They have contact with the barre while they also hold their own balance. Self-carriage is constantly evolving. It is related to both balance and to strength. Remember that the time of the next period to push (ask for more self-carriage or more hind activity) and the time of the next period to plateau (repeat and build where you are) is very specific to each horse. Horse shows can really mess with your plateau period. They make you think “Hmm, we did 2nd level last year so we need to do 3rd this year.” That may not be what your horse needs for development.

Jeremy noted that when the horse is learning a “cruise” shape and speed, he doesn’t add when the paint is still fresh. You need to log in the work so that it is just there (ex. This trot, this canter, this level of activity). It’s just time in that balance.

He also noted that he doesn’t want the balance of the horse to be complacent. It’s always on the way to being more uphill. If the poll is too low or dives, you can’t get after the hind. Generally, as I push at more hind leg power, the poll will come up and they probably will stay round enough because the hind leg will swing through the body. This process comes before the croup stays down and really rotates under.

In canter, explore thinking medium canter with the hind legs, normal canter with the front legs. Think hind leg under: “I’m going to swing you under and drive you up.”

Flying Changes

There needs to more grey area with work on flying changes. It’s a middle ground process. When the canter feels good, put in the change. Don’t assign the change to a letter or a pattern. Make them commonplace. Don’t amp up about it. You have to power up the hind leg for the flying change. Think of creating an energy spike. Feel free to do this and then catch your horse off guard with a change when they have this power. You can ride the canter up, spike the energy, turn around the arena and change. No big ramp up to “here comes the change.”

We do teach horses “the waiting game.” Wait for my aid, and then receive my aid. We do this throughout the work.

As part of flying change prep, make sure you can do a slow change of bend away from lead for 5-6 strides on a circle, and keep the new outside rein contact and keep the poll up.

For a horse who is more challenged to understand the idea of the change, here is another approach: Do counter canter on a 20 meter circle. Slowly change the bend as above. With the whip, tap, Tap, TAP on the new outside hind and bounce them into the change. As you do this, think of riding a canter with their poll and even high. It is okay if the canter gets a bit tight and jumpy—this will help them bounce into the change. Don’t let their forehand surge away from you. After the change, keep them cantering and restablish a nice canter, then praise and take a break. You will probably need to use this method for a week or so and can then start transition to more normal aids. This approach is to show the horses what the movement is and to help them be in position to achieve it. It also sets them up to change in the hind first (in fact one of the horses in the clinic did several changes behind first as he was sorting this out---but that is way better than late behind and easy to fix by keeping them on the aids). If the horse remains calm during this work, feel free to do lots of changes.

About 80-90% of the time, horses need to be higher in the poll to achieve the change. You need an energy spike in the hind leg and to translate that reaction through the body into the change. You can practice energy spikes—touch with the leg/spur/whip to make the hind lively on request.

For a horse who finds the changes very difficult (ex. Friesian), you have to teach the horse to canter faster with the hind legs and to canter smaller in order to have a chance at a clean change. Do work on a 20 meter circle to quicken the hinds, shorten the canter and raise the poll.

[piedmontfields]

I'm intrigued by the "littlest tick on the rein = down transition" - Callie is habitually behind the leg, and it has taken time to convince her that she should go forward into contact. She is sneaky about being behind the leg also so one of my early clues that she has gone there is that touching the rein results in a downward transition instead of a rebalance and feeling of "recycled power". Was this comment specifically for very forward minded horses, or is this something that would apply to all? And if to all, how would you maintain the forward and a steady contact?

Gwen, I'm going to point you to the notes about the Behind the Leg/Sticky Horse and the earlier notes about riding with one hand to clarify connection steadiness and the horse's preferred poll zone. I think both topics could be helpful for your questions.

I do think JS was talking about his ideal for the rein effect. He does not want horses running into the rein--he wants them to respect the hand. He emphasized that with any horse with connection issues, you have to address balance to address connection.

[musical comedy]

More Notes from Jeremy Steinberg Clinic

Suggestions for Different Types of Horses and Training Challenges

Cob-Type Horse with Up-Down Hind Leg

This kind of hind leg can look very active, but we need to look at what kind of activity it is doing! With this sort of conformation, the hind can have a tendency to bounce up and down instead of supporting a swinging, reaching gait. Try using big sweeping lateral movements (ex. Leg yields) to get longer strides and to unwind the spind. My horse isn't a cob type, but he has the tendency to bounce up and down rather than reach. It a slow up/down though, not quick. I don't find lateral work (leg yield) helpful for this at all. Just slows him down more.

Behind the Leg or Sticky Feeling Horse

You have to program in the correct speed in front of you. This is establishing that basic “idle” or “cruising” speed for walk, trot and canter. We do not chase the horse with the leg to do this, but rather have a soft leg and use the whip to clarify GO. We don’t use the leg to sustain. Remember, with the hot horses, do not use the hands to hold them back—don’t fight with the mouth/neck. If the horse gets strong or charges off, do a quick transition to walk and then transition back up. Don’t fight in the walk and don’t worry about perfect transitions as much as doing the transitions.
I'm not understanding idle/crusing. Maybe you can expand on that a bit. I have learned with a horse like this that no leg is best. Leg for aid, and then take leg off.

The arc of the topine is the absorption point (top of the bow) for energy. The arc of the topline is also a point of potential energy as it bows up. We sometimes have to ride the shape over the feeling. When the body is the right shape and is working, the horse becomes softer and lighter (assuming basic conformation). In some cases, we have to set specific resistant walls to help them with the shape and the work (ex. Sometimes we do have to ask for more roundness). Pretty much what you wrote earlier and I totally agree. You have to get 'the bow', round over the back, even though I know that some people don't like that term.

On the whip and horse’s education: You should use the whip less over time, and when you do use it, it should be sharper. This teaches the horses that the consequences become sharper. I wish. As I said, my horse doesn't respond to a whip. Dull to it. Was always that way and I made it worse I guess. It's too late now to go back and fix it, and I don't have the inclination. If ever I were to have a new horse, then I'd make sure it responded properly to the whip. I have a friend that has significant FEI experience on multiple horses. She spends the winter in Florida working with bnt's. Upon return this year, her horse now will not accept the whip. It kicks out and gets frantic. So...even the bnt's can screw this up.

When you establish the idle speed for each gait, you are establishing muscle memory. For ex., when we trot, we do this trot, etc. With a young horse or a re-training situation, it can be okay to be very formulaic about the workload, for ex., we are cantering for 2 minutes at this idle speed.This lost me.

Remember that walk is very hard for a horse to sort out: Are we working or are we relaxing? Be careful to be clear.Now THIS is of big interest to me. I did not think about this. I have just recently tried to get my horse to understand. I am one of those riders that never spent time at the walk. That is because all my trainers were of the mindset that you can too easily ruin the walk. Thus, I did little of it except relax on a long rein. Then in a test, when I would do a down transition to walk, my horse would die on me (thinking it was rest time). As a result, my TOH's or WP would suffer greatly.

With young horses, their job is to learn to work consistently, with self-sustained idle speed. This takes years of quiet “cruising” and “motoring” under saddle. As soon as a young horse gets the idea, make it the standard and repeat it. This communicates “Now this is the way” and we expect that every time without fail.Again, lost.

Think of your warm-up as your “commute to work.” It needs to get you to work! Work involves a higher poll and pushing at engagement.

Makes sense, but I'm starting to wonder just how much of Jeremy's thinking is being influenced by Belasik. I don't know what Belasik is like now (Dressuer would know), but when I rode with him in 1999, he was fixated on having a poll high at the expense of throughness and suppleness. I still see that lacking in his horses, even though they can do the higher level work.

Notice if you are chasing your horse into a tight back. They may need to do work to loosen their back (ex. trot-canter-trot-canter) to move freely forward.This is also very helpful to me. I have never done a lot of trot-canter-trot transitions. I did not know that it helps free a tight back. My guy has today off, but tomorrow I am going to do this.

The Hard-to-Stretch Horse

Remember, that you might not be able to stretch them honestly that much. To keep the horse on contact and connected during a stretch, think of “stair-steppling” them down one inch lower, one inch out, very deliberately. This can be easier to control sitting than rising.Everything is easier sitting imo. My horse thinks so too.

Don’t fixate on the stretch performance you think you need in a test. Be honest in the work.

Developing Self-Carriage

Think of the ballet dancer at the barre. They have contact with the barre while they also hold their own balance. Self-carriage is constantly evolving. It is related to both balance and to strength. Remember that the time of the next period to push (ask for more self-carriage or more hind activity) and the time of the next period to plateau (repeat and build where you are) is very specific to each horse. Horse shows can really mess with your plateau period. They make you think “Hmm, we did 2nd level last year so we need to do 3rd this year.” That may not be what your horse needs for development.Horse showing can mess with a lot of things. With some people, when there is a show coming up, they start pressing for more quality more this and that. Not good. My trainer uses the winter to school and the summer to show. He doesn't start new things while the horse is showing.

Jeremy noted that when the horse is learning a “cruise” shape and speed, he doesn’t add when the paint is still fresh. You need to log in the work so that it is just there (ex. This trot, this canter, this level of activity). It’s just time in that balance.Lost

He also noted that he doesn’t want the balance of the horse to be complacent. It’s always on the way to being more uphill. If the poll is too low or dives, you can’t get after the hind. Generally, as I push at more hind leg power, the poll will come up and they probably will stay round enough because the hind leg will swing through the body. This process comes before the croup stays down and really rotates under. Is there a typo in this? First it says if the poll is too low or the horse dives, you CAN'T get after the hind. Then it says if you push for more hind leg power, the poll will come up. Isn't this conflicting?

In canter, explore thinking medium canter with the hind legs, normal canter with the front legs. Think hind leg under: “I’m going to swing you under and drive you up.” Quicken the hinds, slow the front.

Flying Changes

There needs to more grey area with work on flying changes. It’s a middle ground process. When the canter feels good, put in the change. Don’t assign the change to a letter or a pattern. Make them commonplace. Don’t amp up about it. You have to power up the hind leg for the flying change. Think of creating an energy spike. Feel free to do this and then catch your horse off guard with a change when they have this power. You can ride the canter up, spike the energy, turn around the arena and change. No big ramp up to “here comes the change.” What's the difference between 'power up' and 'ramp up'?

We do teach horses “the waiting game.” Wait for my aid, and then receive my aid. We do this throughout the work.

As part of flying change prep, make sure you can do a slow change of bend away from lead for 5-6 strides on a circle, and keep the new outside rein contact and keep the poll up. This is not easy. I had an instructor have me turn just the neck the other way, but not the whole body. This is a straightness exercise, right? I wouldn't want to try this with my horse right now. Pretty sure he might change or get confused.

[musical comedy]

You've got 136 views and only a couple posts. These are excellent notes with lots to helpful tips for every kind of horse and rider.

[Srhorselady]

You take excellent notes. After I audit a clinic and go back over my notes I frequently find notes that make me scratch my head and say huh? There were several little tidbits that I found useful, especially training the horse for a cruise control in each gait. Now to implement them!

[Josette]

I've viewed this post several times to study and digest all the information. Piedmontfields - WOW! You take awesome notes and thank you for sharing them. MC - you ask good questions which helps to better understand the insights. I know I'll read through several more times.

[Dresseur]

Makes sense, but I'm starting to wonder just how much of Jeremy's thinking is being influenced by Belasik. I don't know what Belasik is like now (Dressuer would know), but when I rode with him in 1999, he was fixated on having a poll high at the expense of throughness and suppleness. I still see that lacking in his horses, even though they can do the higher level work.

I also read over the notes, most of this is what I've heard in daily work, clinics and lessons. I would say that there are differences in Steinberg and Paul - for instance, I have never, ever once heard Paul or Andrea advocate any flexing or counter bending as part as the flying change prep - but, JS is definitely influenced by him, and as P tries to revitalize his career now that Andrea has moved on, I expect to see more "endorsements" between the two of them.

[Chisamba]

Did he actually say all that or did you deduce it from his teaching instuctions?

Was it a demo rider teaching format?

[piedmontfields]

Glad the notes have been enjoyed. It is easy for me to do, as it is just how I keep track of things!

I'll try to respond to some specific questions below--not necessarily in order!

Chisamba: He did basically say all that. He is a verbal clinician and he also has plenty of time to talk while students work on multiple transitions! However, please do not treat these notes as quotes, as I am paraphrasing and "translating" into summaries. When I respond to questions, I am interpreting meaning from his instructions. The format was a clinic---ten lessons each day.

Musical Comedy: I trust Dresseur on assessing Belasik's influence. Certainly that is not JS's only influence, though.

"Generally, as I push at more hind leg power, the poll will come up and they probably will stay round enough because the hind leg will swing through the body. This process comes before the croup stays down and really rotates under. Is there a typo in this? First it says if the poll is too low or the horse dives, you CAN'T get after the hind. Then it says if you push for more hind leg power, the poll will come up. Isn't this conflicting?" Not quite. If your horse is too poll low, it is very hard to activate the hind leg and power them up. So step one, bring up the poll. When riding your horse in a decent balance (not with the poll low), you will also experience the poll coming higher when you get after the hind leg to be more active. When we challenge the horse for more activity or for a new movement (ex. flying changes), they usually raise the poll to help themselves do it. This is back to his suggestion to not fight with the head and to give horses an escape route.

"Power up" vs "Ramp up": Power up refers to engagement of the hind legs. Ramp up or amp up refers to the horse or riding getting tight/tense/anticipatory. Happens a lot to riders working changes.

Some overall comments Steinberg made for all lessons:

I like that balance , referring to the overall shape of horse (including poll position)

Maintain your alignment---do not ride behind the vertical (caveat: Unless you are a beginner just starting to find your seat)

Activate your back muscles, especially your lats. This will change the feeling in your arms and hands.

And finally some general comments on what this sort of teaching does for me (because I am not lucky enough to hear it all the time like Dresseur!). IOW, these are some of my main take aways from this clinic:


-It is worth it to focus on developing the gaits. I used to think that my horse's gaits where just what they were---but after taking this approach more seriously over the last few years, I am amazed by how much better my mare's trot and canter are, and that they are still improving.

-It is important not to get fixated on movements or test patterns. When you focus on improving balance and engagement, the movements are surprisingly easy.

-When working out new challenges, don't be alarmed if the poll is high (ex. early flying changes). It kind of has to be to help the horse get the hind leg working. In time, you can address roundness through the change.

-With a horse like mine (hot, sensitive Iberian type), it is important to be as quiet a rider as possible. It's what she wants and she is very generous in responding to that quiet steadiness. In fact, being super quiet in the contact is the only way she is genuinely willing to connect.

-In lateral work, don't sacrifice bend for angle (ex. in shoulder in). I always need to remember this so that we really get the elongation of the outside of the body.

[musical comedy]

Ok, thanks. But...

If your horse is too poll low, it is very hard to activate the hind leg and power them up. So step one, bring up the poll. When riding your horse in a decent balance (not with the poll low), you will also experience the poll coming higher when you get after the hind leg to be more active.

How does he recommended bringing up the poll?

In lateral work, don't sacrifice bend for angle (ex. in shoulder in). I always need to remember this so that we really get the elongation of the outside of the body.

I see many videos of AA riders doing 2nd and even 3rd where they show a poor shoulder in. No bend, no angle, no energy. Yet, judges give them a 6 or 6.5 for it.

[Chisamba]

I actually prefer a format where the clinician is very focused on the rider, horse and the moment they are in. I am not fond of clinicians who expend a lot of time talking to the auditors. Just my preference. I want to know that the clinician actually saw my aid, my horses response, and is going to be able to give me real time input on how to modify that aid to improve the response.

from a clinic a few years ago, the clinician told my student to keep the contact even in both reins, and the horse looked out the door, every time it went past. The clinician repeated, keep the contact even in both reins. so each time the horse looked out the door, my student followed the motion to keep the contact even in both reins. So the clinician said to the auditors, i do not understand who the person thinks allowing the horse to look out the door is keeping the contact even in both reins. there was no information given to the rider about addressing unevenness in the contact and how to shape the horse to keep the contact even in both reins. So, the clinic only worked for people who already understood the theory, and was of no help to people who were trying to learn or did not understand it.

So, of course, we simply never used that clinician again. We kind of prefer the practical approach, Christian Bachinger said, when a horse looked out, keep his attention on your aids, use a little inside leg to refocus his attention on you. Immediate practical advice for the rider, which would be missed by the auditor unless they were focused and paying attention themselves. This is why i will go to Christian Bachinger again.

my preference, i understand there are as many preferences as there are people

[Chisamba]

Ok, thanks. But...

If your horse is too poll low, it is very hard to activate the hind leg and power them up. So step one, bring up the poll. When riding your horse in a decent balance (not with the poll low), you will also experience the poll coming higher when you get after the hind leg to be more active.

How does he recommended bringing up the poll?

In lateral work, don't sacrifice bend for angle (ex. in shoulder in). I always need to remember this so that we really get the elongation of the outside of the body.

I see many videos of AA riders doing 2nd and even 3rd where they show a poor shoulder in. No bend, no angle, no energy. Yet, judges give them a 6 or 6.5 for it.

Christian Bachinger asked us to activate the hind end to bring up the front, he never specifically addressed the poll to my memory, but he addressed the inclination of a horse to pull down.

in my opinion if the poll is too high the horse cannot activate the hind end either, too low, no good, to high, no good, and lots of it is based on breed and conformation.

[Dresseur]

I can't speak for what JS said in regards to this, but from what I have been taught - you have to think of it in terms of changing the balance of the horse, so, form follows function here. If the poll is too low, you have to bring up the poll or any increased power drives the horse further onto the forehand. This is achieved by bumping the horse up in the bridle - basically, upwards hh... So if the horse leans down, lift the hands quickly and then ask the hind end for more activity - basically, you are tipping the see-saw up. So, make room up front by bringing the poll up and send the haunches further under into the "space" the elevated poll gives. This has to happen over and over and over again. It's not a once and done deal, they have to be rather small movements repeated as often as necessary. For the rider to achieve this though, they have to "hold" the horse every time they ask for more activity behind, or the horse just spreads out and never changes the balance.

The converse of that - if the horse is already in a decent shape (poll high or close to it), if you use the hh and add power behind, the horse will come up in the shoulders. It's about making the shoulders light, not just the mouth. Again, it's a change of balance, not just placement of the parts.

in regards to this:

In lateral work, don't sacrifice bend for angle (ex. in shoulder in). I always need to remember this so that we really get the elongation of the outside of the body.

I see many videos of AA riders doing 2nd and even 3rd where they show a poor shoulder in. No bend, no angle, no energy. Yet, judges give them a 6 or 6.5 for it.

I agree, lots of poorly ridden shoulder ins. But, IMO, this is not a black and white bend always trumping displacement/angle. There is a time and a place to ask for more displacement, less bend (4 track shoulder in) or, more bend, less displacement (3 track shoulder in). But, you should always be after the correct bend.

(edited to add clarity to my use of the word abrupt - wrong word chosen lol)

[piedmontfields]

Ok, thanks. But...

If your horse is too poll low, it is very hard to activate the hind leg and power them up. So step one, bring up the poll. When riding your horse in a decent balance (not with the poll low), you will also experience the poll coming higher when you get after the hind leg to be more active.

How does he recommended bringing up the poll?

A few options:
An upward half halt with hands (bump them up!)
An upward half halt with leg (bump them up!)

In a prior clinic, I recall Jeremy encouraging riders to think that there was a electric fence strand below which their horse's head should not fall. If they dropped too low, give a "zapping" "electric" half halt. The main point I got was that these are quick and a bit abrupt and attention-getting, to communicate "Hey you! Stay up here!!".

Note that I see Dresseur says these are not abrupt. Maybe that is not the right word....I'll think about that! I would say that they are not slow, they are clear, and they are as frequent as necessary!

Chisamba, in this particular clinic, none of the horses tended to be too high in the poll or hollow. Most were too low/closed--hence the poll up theme. FYI, JS spent little or no time talking to auditors and was very attentive to his riders. He did give them time to work on what they were working on though, which I like (but I could see that some people would prefer something else). I hope you will post notes and insights from your clinic!

[Dresseur]

Sorry, by not abrupt, I meant they aren't intended to be a huge movement - or knock a horse off balance... They are small, lightning quick movements - you can't hold onto the hh at all. So, I did not use the correct word.

Also, I will say that the upward hh is about the hand AND the leg together. If you just pick up the poll with no corresponding ask from the leg, the horse will just hollow and leave the hind legs out behind.

[piedmontfields]

Sorry, by not abrupt, I meant they aren't intended to be a huge movement - or knock a horse off balance... They are small, lightning quick movements - you can't hold onto the hh at all. So, I did not use the correct word.

Thanks for clarifying--that is how I understood them too. I like the idea of an "electric half halt"! A quick movement and a release.

[Chisamba]

IIf the poll is too low, you have to bring up the poll or any increased power drives the horse further onto the forehand.

yes, but you do not have to bring the poll up with your hands. If you activate the hind end the horse will lift itself so long as you allow it to. no matter how you word it, bumping, lifting abruptly, i cannot think of a "way" to put it that does not sound crude

[Dresseur]

I'm not sure that I agree with that. If you have a horse that leans, or ducks, simply getting after the hind end for increased power or activity will not change the front unless some sort of action or parameter is set there. Otherwise, what is to stop that increased power or activity from continuing its on the forehand trajectory? I'm not talking about the abrupt Demi arrets, more, setting a boundary and keeping the bit lively so that the horse cannot lean, and to encourage the horse to come up a bit. I wouldn't do one action without the other, the same as you wouldn't do an action up front without addressing the hinds as well.

[musical comedy]

The quick lifting up with my hands has been a huge breakthrough for me (after all these years). I suppose it depends on the horse, the rider, and how we explain what we are doing.

[Chisamba]

never mind

[Tsavo]

First I am surprised to hear PB does not separate the aids and would not to hands alone but do leg simultaneously. I think of him as French influenced but I don't really know that.

Second, I think there is more than one right answer for some of these issues and that which right answer it will be is mostly dependent on the training to date.

[Tsavo]

The other thing is walk work. I am no Olympic rider yet I have been taught how to do walk work correctly and use it often. For people who want to know what correct collected walk feels like they should train on downhills. My aged horse will ball up (engage) and sink way into his hind joints and hold himself. Recently I have been able to get a bit of forward and out and down within the collected walk and even control the step size. This is hard work and it is most of the work I did yesterday. He was sweating.

[Dresseur]

Tsavo, his major influencers were van Schaik and Oliveira. He does not look favorably on modern French, like PK. Hand and leg are used a hairs breadth apart- you are not ramming the horse into the hand with a constantly driving seat, nor are you doing hand only. I suppose you could make the argument that sometimes leg or seat is used, but always with an eye to the correct posture. Although, recently, some things that I thought were "sacred" seem to have changed in his standards. Especially in regards to his latest "protégé".

Chisamba, I have not forgotten about your question re Charm- I've been away and it will be easier to type it all out on an actual keyboard, not phone lol

[no.stirrups]

Ignoring the feel is an idea that confused me at first reading, but after a couple of examples were given, I think I get it. Many people have horses that are not really connected, maybe BTV or just a little sucked back, but they think it's good because the horse is light. Then when they get a real connection it is heavier than they are used to and they don't like how that feels. As the horse gets stronger and accustomed to the connection they will become light again. Am I right? Is this what he meant?

[piedmontfields]

Ignoring the feel is an idea that confused me at first reading, but after a couple of examples were given, I think I get it. Many people have horses that are not really connected, maybe BTV or just a little sucked back, but they think it's good because the horse is light. Then when they get a real connection it is heavier than they are used to and they don't like how that feels. As the horse gets stronger and accustomed to the connection they will become light again. Am I right? Is this what he meant?

Yes, you got it! When you are changing things (getting more connected, accessing more power), JS pointed out that it is normal for it to feel "terrible." However, it doesn't look terrible and it will evolve and you will get used to a new feel, too.

Another point JS made was that ride a horse very deep (too low) is comfortable for the rider. The back feels good to the rider. However, it is not a position where the horse can move powerfully. So changing that balance can "feel bad" for the rider (they may have more to sit).