Neck arthritis

capstone
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Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Tue Aug 23, 2016 9:49 pm

khall wrote:He did come back to me in his mid 20s, ended up having neck arthritis (he had flipped at some point) that caused him neuro issues, he was PTS at almost 27.

I saw this statement from khall on the training thread and it struck a chord.

My older guy, Wakkidu aka Kuper if anyone remembers him, has neck arthritis. Diagnosed almost 3 years ago now after a period of struggling and NQR-ness. According to x-ray, 4 of his vertebra were almost if not completely fused. I had owned him more than 18 months at this time. He is one of the few horses whose neck I didn't have x-rayed as part of the PPE. Vet said the fusion would have been occurring over a period of many years and likely the surgery he had the prior spring where he had to have general anesthetic and be laid flat on the table allowed the muscles in his neck to relax/reset such that they were no longer holding the vertebra in a comfortable position. Or something like that - if it makes any sense.

He never had any real neuro symptoms outside of that exam, where a fair amount of pressure was put on his neck as part of the diagnostic process. And I would say those symptoms were fairly mild compared to what I experienced with Brio on his later, bad days.

I tried to persevere on after the diagnosis, thinking that Training/First level could be manageable. Neck injections really gave us a boost for a period of time. However, even with a higher than "legal" dose of Previcox on board, the work became a major struggle again. It was that next summer that I decided it was in all of our best interests for Kuper to be eased into retirement. It happened over the course of 5-6 months, as I was looking for what turned out to be Cartier. Kuper has been fully retired now for almost 2 years. He has some additional quirks that make even an occasional light ride just not any fun for either of us, so that means no riding or work at all.

He is 20 years old now, so not so old. And he very much enjoys his life of leisure, sharing turnout with 2 ponies that he seems to think are his babies. Most of the time, he gives the stink eye to anyone who appears to be coming to get him. :lol: He definitely prefers his own company and that of his pasture mates to people.

So to my question, I guess. Since he is out of work and therefore the pressure on his neck is minimal, should I expect him to live out a fairly normal life? Or will symptoms present at some point, simply as a matter of progression of the condition? Maybe pointless, unanswerable questions. But khall's comment about the horse flipping made me wonder, in the absence of such trauma, what might be expected.

Pics of the old man and I, lest anyone accuse me of favoring Cartier. ;)
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PaulaO
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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby PaulaO » Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:01 pm

I think the answer is: it depends on the horse. I've known 2 horses with neck arthritis. One is TB who is about 25. He was diagnosed at least 7-8 years ago, has had every treatment including a port for IV steroids. Some days he's crooked, other days just fine. The owner still lightly rides him. I expect him to live forever and die of something else. The other horse was a Paint who had to be euthed at age 15 because he couldn't get up due to the arthritis. If Kuper is showing no/minimal mobility issues, I'm guessing he'll be with you for quite some time.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:52 pm

PaulaO wrote:I expect him to live forever and die of something else.

This sounds about right. Right at 1 year before this arthritis dx, he came 1/2" from severing his carotid artery and bleeding out in the pasture. Between this and almost losing his eye requiring emergency corneal grafts, I expect it to be something dramatic.

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Flight
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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Flight » Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:17 pm

I don't have any experience with neck arthritis so thanks for sharing.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Wed Aug 24, 2016 8:37 pm

Neither had I, before my current trainer. Funny thing is that we "always" get neck x-rays - it's my trainer's rule of thumb for anything but babies.

Brio only had one joint that was involved but his was causing much more severe, typical neuro symptoms.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Wed Aug 24, 2016 8:40 pm

Flight wrote:I don't have any experience with neck arthritis so thanks for sharing.

More on this...it didn't present at all like neck arthritis. My trainer was kicking herself after the fact for not suspecting earlier, but I'm not sure anyone would have.

We were having issues somewhat like I have described with Cartier on the training forum regarding energy except my trainer also could not motivate him to go forward. With Cartier, the issue is just me and it is improving.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Koolkat » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:14 pm

No information to add, but he looks like a mighty cute pasture pony!

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Chisamba
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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Chisamba » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:33 pm

I had the care a horse with neck arthritis, he had a major traumatic event, fell over a jump and landed hard on his neck. Neuro symptoms presented. The horse seemed to be a happy pasture ornament intil we realised he never ever lay down. Then one day as he aged, he lay down and could not get up.

After some discussion with the owner and vet we realized he wanted to lie down to rest, but was afraid to. Then he progresses to being unable to graze because the neck wouls not lower sufficiently . We hung hay bags. Then he progresses to having difficulty jerking the hay put of the bag.

We let him go before winter. The cold made it worse. He was uncomfortable, could not lie down to rest, and had difficulty moving his neck to eat. He was 24.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:57 pm

Chisamba wrote:I had the care a horse with neck arthritis, he had a major traumatic event, fell over a jump and landed hard on his neck. Neuro symptoms presented. The horse seemed to be a happy pasture ornament intil we realised he never ever lay down. Then one day as he aged, he lay down and could not get up.

After some discussion with the owner and vet we realized he wanted to lie down to rest, but was afraid to. Then he progresses to being unable to graze because the neck wouls not lower sufficiently . We hung hay bags. Then he progresses to having difficulty jerking the hay put of the bag.

We let him go before winter. The cold made it worse. He was uncomfortable, could not lie down to rest, and had difficulty moving his neck to eat. He was 24.

The traumatic event was the cause of his arthritis?

Thank you, some things to watch for in there.

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Chisamba
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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Chisamba » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:02 pm

Captone, yes, at first it was undetected, then the horse seemed to be blocked, not forward, hesitant, then he became neurological, could not really tell where his front feet were. this process took about two years, and we felt stupid for not realizing what it was sooner

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Thu Aug 25, 2016 6:03 am

Chisamba wrote:Captone, yes, at first it was undetected, then the horse seemed to be blocked, not forward, hesitant, then he became neurological, could not really tell where his front feet were. this process took about two years, and we felt stupid for not realizing what it was sooner

Some of this sounds similar. Thanks.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby khall » Thu Aug 25, 2016 8:17 pm

My OTTB g also would not lay down when he came back to me (so not sure when the neck fractured occurred since I had not done neck films on him when I bought him. No neuro issues when I owned him before, trained to 3rd when his feet fell apart) and watching him loose in the field I thought he either had eye issues or neuro issues. I did ride him a bit when he came back until he started showing me signs of pain. We tried several things to help him, steroids and previcox, except injections (because there were too many spots) when I decided it was time. He was losing weight, not eating well and the not sleeping then falling in the stall, started to walk/pace in the pasture which was a sign of him not being happy.

I knew of a stallion that ended up with wobblers when he aged, causing neuro issues, was euthanized because of it.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:10 pm

Koolkat wrote:No information to add, but he looks like a mighty cute pasture pony!

Oops, I missed this!

Thanks, he's a goofball. He must have been feeling photogenic those days because most of his photos are not so flattering.

A goofy one.
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And here he is in the pasture.
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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Moutaineer » Sat Aug 27, 2016 4:05 am

Well, my lovely Laddie supposedly has neck arthritis.

Which is why I have such a nice horse.

There are some visible changes on x-ray, which makes him a flunk out as far as vetting is concerned, but so far, for me, (fingers crossed and I can't believe I am typing this out loud) he has shown no neuro signs and has been nothing but sound and a joy to ride.

I am very careful not to jam him into a frame or crank on him, but I wouldn't do that to any horse. I am also acutely aware of the importance of saddle fit, regular, quality hoof care, and solid nutrition for him. I suspect that therein lies the reason that he is performing well for me and simply refused to canter for a previous purchaser, who was somewhat slipshod about those things and had hands of iron.

I am aware that I am potentially on borrowed time, but he's happy and comfortable in his work at the moment.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby capstone » Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:56 pm

Moutaineer wrote:He's happy and comfortable in his work at the moment.

This is great. Kuper was, for the most part, until after his eye surgery.

Everyone knows that horses with great X-rays can go lame and horses with terrible X-rays can stay sound.

I haven't knowingly bought a horse with bad neck X-rays but a friend did. His neck didn't ever give him any trouble; unfortunately she lost him to something unrelated.

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Re: Neck arthritis

Postby Ryeissa » Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:48 pm

Ryeissa did, I was told if they have it one place they can have it anywhere. I didn't know this till the neuro stuff started and we did more evaluation of her head and neck (un-related).

She was on legend and adequan which helped generally so I can only assume it helped this as well.

She died from something else, so I can't help with your specific questions about long term care.


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