Hives

[Moutaineer]

Help! I'd really appreciate the thoughts of the UDBB "hive mind" on this problem.

Potters is on his third round with hives since I have owned him. First time in May, second time about 6 weeks ago, and now again. In between the second and current rounds, he has moved barns.

Vet has treated each time with dex shots, which worked almost instantly, and a follow up course of hydroxyzine.

We are now looking at allergy testing.

However, in the mean time, I'm trying to see if there is anything glaring in his diet that stands out as a potential trigger.

It's all pretty simple, and has not changed since the barn move--in fact largely has not changed in the 6 months that I have owned him apart from some minor tinkering with supplements:

Purina Wellsolve LS, which is very low grain (they say "no grain" but the ingredients list wheat middlings and ground oat hulls, so that makes no sense to me...) alfalfa based pelleted feed.

Smartcalm Ultra or regular Smartcalm pellets (dates of switching between these two do not correlate with any hive attacks, only difference between the two is increased quantity of magnesium and L-tryptophan in the Ultra)

SmartMuscle mass pellets (These are a more recent addition in August so I don't think they can be involved. I do note that these also have L-Tryptophan in them--maybe too much of a good thing?)

FastTrack probiotic

1/4 tab of previcox (vet says very unlikely to be involved.)

Hay was pure grass at previous barn, where he had 2 rounds of this. New barn is grass/alfalfa mix, pretty light on the alfalfa.

(In his previous home, he was on a much heavier alfalfa mix hay, and a strange bucket feed that was timothy pellet based with every supplement under the sun added to it as separate elements--really, I've never seen a more complicated feeding system! As far as I'm aware this is a new issue that she did not deal with.)

Previous barn, bagged shavings, current barn, bulk sawdust. Rubber mats in both.

Both barns, dry lot turnouts, but the ability to get at some weeds with some fence limbo-ing.

Both barns probably have similar insect population profiles. We've just had a major freeze here so most bugs have died, but this current round started before that. So, if it is bug-bite related (which with a May start up seems a distinct possibility) we should be in the clear until next spring now...

I wash all my pads in no added anything soap and double rinse them all. But the distribution of the hives doesn't look like that's the problem to me.

The hives are worse on his neck but spread across his torso as well. They do not appear itchy or to bother him much at all.

He is, of course, a chestnut...


Any thoughts? I'm a bit stumped. I had really hoped that the environmental change with moving barns would solve the problem.

[Chisamba]

I have a few horses that get major hives from bug bites. I have also had horses react to wheat in the diet,, or soy. but imho if his diet has been consistent and he had icky had a few stages with hives, diet is less likely.

but, I get really nasty allergy related breathing problems ( like asthma attacks) and always blamed the trigger, turns out the allergy and the trigger were two different things. so it is possible he is allergic to one thing ( feed) and triggered by another) ( bites)

[Josette]

Do a GOOGLE search on Horse RAST testing which is used to identify allergens. It is very accurate to identify food allergies and other things that make Potters reactive. Myself and a friend had it performed years ago on our horses for allergies - her horse allergic to corn and my horse was sensitive to alfalfa and some trees. Discuss with your vet what allergens it screens. Chisamba mention of bugs is also high possible cause too. I've had a horrible year with chigger bites on legs due to all the rain. Good Luck!

[tlkidding]

Have you tried rinsing him off with a cup of white vinegar in a small bucket of water? If that helps clear up the hives, then you know it's a contact allergy versus something he's consuming.

My horse gets hives from the mud/dirt if we've had a dry spell and then rain and he rolls. If it's muddy and he rolls every day, no hives. But there's something that bothers him only after it's been dry for a while and now is wet. A rinse with diluted vinegar mostly clears it up. He's a very sensitive chestnut too!

[Ryeissa]

my horse got really big hives from a fly spray. I'm sure that isn't your issue but throwing it out there. it was where the flyspray was applied but I had used the product before with no issues. I think the concentrate was a bit off in % and it might have been stronger for some reason or i didn't shake it.

Could it be some sort of photosensitivity?

[Moutaineer]

Actually, Rye, I've been thinking... I've been out of town and my trainer has been grooming him before she rides, and made a throwaway remark about using a particular coat spray in his mane and tail before every ride. I remember now having an "I wonder..." moment about something I had been using when he broke out last time, but it had completely slipped my mind.

I've had so much going on the last couple of months on its been hard to keep track of those kind of things.

I shall investigate further.

The first dex shot has pretty much cleared everything up, I'm happy to say.

[Moutaineer]

After another round of bumps, vet has pulled blood and sent it off for allergy testing. We await (and await...) the results with interest.

[exvet]

Doing the RAST test on my stinker pony actually helped significantly. There was nothing in his feed but cats (yes, cats) and palo verde trees were the culprit. So, the barn cat became a house cat and eventually I moved to property that did not have any palo verde trees on it or near it. He has since become a very happy, healthy pony but I was challenged to find the right mix of treatment to keep him comfortable until the 'no palo verde trees within 5 miles became a reality.

[Moutaineer]

Test results are back...

Oats
Cottonseed
Flax (really high!)

So now I have to work out a fairly high-calorie diet which doesn't contain any of these thngs.

[blob]

Test results are back...

Oats
Cottonseed
Flax (really high!)

So now I have to work out a fairly high-calorie diet which doesn't contain any of these thngs.

If you have the budget for it...I've been working with an equine nutritionist and it has been a super experience. It would be a good way to help find a good way to get Potters what he needs without any of his allergens and in the easiest way for you possible.

[heddylamar]

Awww. Poor guy! Flax and oats are so common.

[Chisamba]

Test results are back...

Oats
Cottonseed
Flax (really high!)

So now I have to work out a fairly high-calorie diet which doesn't contain any of these thngs.

wow, my vet recommends flax to counter allergies. really great you had him tested. will you look into a rice bran based diet?

[exvet]

Test results are back...

Oats
Cottonseed
Flax (really high!)

So now I have to work out a fairly high-calorie diet which doesn't contain any of these thngs.

wow, my vet recommends flax to counter allergies. really great you had him tested. will you look into a rice bran based diet?

Ditto, or echoing what Chisamba said and Blob as well. In this case given all that you're striving to do with Potters, contacting a good equine nutritionist familiar with what you have 'easily' available in your area would probably be money well spent.

[Moutaineer]

My old friend who runs the local feed store is an equine nutritionist, so he was my first stop this morning. His thoughts are along the same lines as mine--alfalfa pellets, rice bran and a decent vitamin/mineral supplement. Keep it really clean. Our hay is a good quality grass/alfalfa mix, and while it's not free-choice, he can have as much as he needs.

I feel badly for the poor guy. Flax is in everything nowadays. (We even checked out the label on the vitamin and mineral supplements in the feed store... none of them are going to work!) No wonder he's had consistently loose stools and has been struggling with his weight. It would be like me trying to live on shrimp. Dennis the nutritionist says he'll probably pick up condition quite quickly "once I stop poisoning him..." (As I said, we've known each other a long time )

[piedmontfields]

Really helpful that you tested him. No kidding that it is hard to avoid flax! Your plan sounds like a good plan. Glad you have a feed store bud/nutritionist for support and perspective!

We actually have a 17+h event horse on a similar diet at our barn, due to allergies.

[Moutaineer]

6 weeks later, no more hives. Fingrra crossed we have the solution. Hes also put on condition already.

[Canyon]

Yay for some good news! I hope he continues to improve.