Horse shopping, how did you know what you want?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Piedmontfields a Connemara cross would be very cool! My budget right now is $10k max. But if I don't find what I want I'll keep saving through fall/winter. I can't see myself spending more than $15k though.

[blob]

Lipsmacker have you posted an ISO on fb groups? That's how I found RP. I would also post in groups that are not dressage specific. I posted in a hunter group asking for a failed hunter pony (doesn't like to jump) and i got a LOT Of hits many of them well under $10k. I paid $3k for RP. He is not an easy horse so that's partly why I was able to get him for so much less. But that ISO ad got me some very nice, steady, willing types who were nice correct movers, though maybe not super flashy, which i think is fine. There was a large pony mare I really liked who was cheap because she would refuse jumps but was great on the flat. She had a good willing mind, just didn't want to jump. She'd also been started later in life, so she was 6, but had only been under saddle for a year. But she was not green green. I imagine there are other horses like her out there!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Blob, I did in one Colorado group but haven't went that far yet to posting in others. I have been so busy the last few weeks so was waiting until my schedule might be more free to travel.

I know there are far less facebook groups than there was years ago because of the crackdown on sales. I really miss the Dressage sales groups! I think they are gone. But I'll see if the hunter groups are still up. Great idea! Rip looks really cool btw!

[piedmontfields]

For connemaras and crosses, I think you could easily work with that budget. I'm not sure of your location, but this is someone I know in E TN who breeds sensible and capable ones: http://connemaras.com/

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Piedmontfields, in Colorado but can travel. Thank you! I'm checking the website now

[blob]

For connemaras and crosses, I think you could easily work with that budget. I'm not sure of your location, but this is someone I know in E TN who breeds sensible and capable ones: http://connemaras.com/

I'm just a couple hours from there. So, if you see something you like and need someone to take a first look/trial I might be able to, depending on when!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

@blob that's so incredibly sweet! I appreciate that so much! I'll connect with them and if anything sounds like a potential match I definitely would take you up on that!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I always end up liking horses that aren't suitable for Dressage. I rode a horse yesterday, super mind, work ethic but I really don't think the movement is there. Horse shopping is so tough!!

[Josette]

It sounds like that horse would be an ideal lower level dressage prospect. Many folks here are doing great with the off breed non-dressage horses and movers. A wonderful mind is a great asset and work ethic is more than half the battle. Some bigger or fancy horses become harder to sit or ride for average ammy owners imo.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Josette maybe. Or a hunter jumper, which is what he's doing now. I'm thinking of going to see him one more time (he's really close) just to see them lunge him and see without a martingale. I will say he looked better when I rode him than them, but could be that he was warmed up then.

I tend to get along with most horses though, while not everything is my type of ride, I can enjoy most. So I try not to get hung up on that if everything else doesn't fit.

I definitely don't want big mover or fancy. But this guy is definitely below average mover, especially the trot! I know it's the least important gait, the one you can improve. But still, pretty choppy short trot. I'd have to vet him very thoroughly...

[Josette]

Hmmm - that short choppy trot would make me be cautious of foot soreness. why? It sounds like you have some decent radar instincts for what you see and feel. Don't rush into a purchase if you can wait and even save a bit more $ to get a horse that makes you really want it.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Josette I was thinking foot soreness too and he's shod sooo. Or back stiffness.

Honestly reminds me of a horse RIGHT off the track. Foot sore or body sore wise. But he's been off the track for two years so not what I want to see.

Yep saving up! This horse was $9k anyways and overpriced imo. Really cool personality though.

If anything I'll just keep mentally checking what I like in a horse/ride and what I don't!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

One thing that is surprising to me is I really am finding i don't want a BIG horse. I used to love the ones around 16.3/17 plus hands but I find myself searching for smaller for sure.

[exvet]

I've been seeing a few Morgans that could fit your needs being offered lately. Are you on any of the Morgan facebook pages?

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Exvet, not yet! But I will search. I'm in an Arabian group.

[StraightForward]

Have you looked at saddlebreds? No experience with them personally, but they seem to be reasonably priced and can make quite nice dressage horses.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward, I haven't for a prospect. I took care of 9 saddlebreds for a family for 3 years though. I didn't ride them. I can't say they would be a top choice temperament wise but riding one might be different. They were goofy. Lol

[StraightForward]

6 year old Azteca mare in Texas for $7K. Seems like something like that would work well? https://www.dreamhorse.com/ad/2183855/s ... texas.html

ETA: I kind of want this one for myself, another chestnut mare: https://www.dreamhorse.com/ad/2164855/v ... evada.html

I read your thread on the other board, and I think most of those people are cray and/or don't know how to improve on raw material. You can absolutely get a horse that can do 3rd level work, but not a world-beater, on your budget. I just posted videos in the training thread of my Appendix mare 6 months apart. Here is a video of her 2.5 years ago (we lost 18+ months to an injury in between). She is a bit downhill and long, has uneven hips from a likely SI injury and high/low front feet. Her dad has western pleasure breeding. This is also as farthest I've brought a horse along in dressage and have never had the benefit of riding schoolmasters or being in any kind of consistent lesson program. She is not the horse I would buy today if I was going out to get a prospect under $10K, but she is improving by leaps and bounds, and I am hopeful that she can go to third. So I guess my point is, trust the training system to help get you where you're going. A green horse that is more or less level in build and conformation can do it. I think something like one of these Andy crosses could be a great choice, as it would likely be a little shorter-coupled and lighter on the front end than my mare. That is probably what I would be looking for if I was shopping today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MP5sSpgTdWU

[StraightForward]

I found an older video, from fall of her 4-year old year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEPe9tQIIkk

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward, I had to laugh at some responses.

This my favorite forum for a reason!

You are such a lovely rider, what a great job you are doing with your mare!!

[StraightForward]

I like it here better too. I wonder if some of the naysayers are that way because it give them an "out" if they aren't doing the work to progress. Easier to say it is financially out of reach, than to show up every day and work every aspect of fitness, training, theory, nutrition and everything else that can optimize what you have in front of you.

I just uncovered a photo from when I went to look at her. What was I thinking?!
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[StraightForward]

Just window shopping, as one does. This one looks quite nice, and solid APHA = discounted price: https://www.dreamhorse.com/ad/2165153/c ... texas.html

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward she is a cutie!! Good eye!!

[Ryeissa]

yeah! nice horse!

[Chisamba]

I never answered your question. I used to look for the horse most likely to forward my ambition. lately I have looked for the horse that needed me. my the main squeezes were all in precarious situations that could well have ended in their deaths. I decided I would take them on, and either give them a kind death, or rehab then. I am lucky in that good care transformed and improved them and I am still able to forward my ambitions.

[demi]

This post doesn’t exactly fit the topic, but i wanted to mention it for consideration. My mare, Rocky, is half QH and built like her dam who is bulldog type. If allowed to work her own way, she is athletic and well balanced for working cows. BUT, when I started trying to do dressage with her, that balance always made me feel like I was being pitched forward. (Aleuronx describes this well in the training forum as her young mare is going through a growth phase where she is higher behind.) I bought Rocky for trail so I wasn’t too disheartened when I had trouble in dressage. So I bought another mare , Emma, who had been trained to PSG, but was being sold at an unbelievably low price. I rode Em for a year or so. Em is SO comfortable to “ride”. I wish I could describe it. The problem with Em, is that there was a reason she was so cheap ( I knew of the possibility but thought it was worth a gamble).

While not going into the problems with Emma, she loves attention, but she will buck me off if I’m not very careful.

If I was younger, maybe in my 20’s, 30’s, I’d pick Emma over Rocky, because Em is so comfortable and dressage is fairly easy for her. And, while she isn’t a babysitter, she is slowly bonding with me and I am earning her trust by not having any ulterior motives (like dressage!!).

Ideally, I would have Rocky’s temperament in Emma’s body. Since i can’t, I have chosen Rocky to be my dressage partner. Either one would be/ is a slower journey than it could be under more ideal circumstances.

So, how do you know what you want!?!? Good question, but as many of the posts on this thread are showing, another good question might be, “what will fulfill my own personal desires and needs?”.

Good luck, dear! I look forward to you getting a great partner and sharing on the training forum.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

I never answered your question. I used to look for the horse most likely to forward my ambition. lately I have looked for the horse that needed me. my the main squeezes were all in precarious situations that could well have ended in their deaths. I decided I would take them on, and either give them a kind death, or rehab then. I am lucky in that good care transformed and improved them and I am still able to forward my ambitions.

I feel like the last two have found me and spoke to me because I was someone who would do what they needed.This was not a conscious decision.

But now I'm wanting something to forward my riding, something so sound and healthy. Not that I don't want to ever help a horse again, I just hope for a few uncomplicated years.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Demi- that's helpful to think about. Honestly I think I want something in between your Rocky and Emma if possible.

I am in my early 30's. I think this might be my last younger horse because of a connective tissue/joint disorder I have. I think old age will be hard and while I hope I still ride, I think an older steady Eddie then will suit me.

But I love bringing up greenies and I hope to give it one more shot. Just finding the balance of what I want will be the trick!

[Chisamba]

the great thing about green horses is that you really can bring them on as you prefer.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Very true! And I just think it's fun watching them learn and use their bodies better.

[demi]

Rocky was 3 when I got her but I didn’t know for sure that she had the temperament i needed. She was sweet, but hot under saddle, is probably and alpha mare (her dam was), and she tested me a good bit. I took the breeder’s word that she would be my “next best horse” (his words!). He put 30 days on her before I took her home.

It’s still somewhat of a gamble buying a green horse. Buying from an experienced, honest breeder is a good bet, though.

[exvet]

the great thing about green horses is that you really can bring them on as you prefer.

So true! I rode Brandon today on the lunge line. My SO was at the helm and we decided Brandon needed to really solidify the 'go' button. He seemed to catch on and at least I can say there was no 'bronc' initiative or desire there at all.

I far prefer to bring them on myself but as I get older I realize that I must be very specific and careful in picking the right disposition I click with for sure.

Lipsmacker.....I just saw where Brandon's breeder sold the gelding I suggested OTOB. He went to a well deserving kid. There is a mare for sale that I quite like up in the Northern tier if your interested in a started, well rounded Morgan.

[silk]

Well, I might have bred one of them, but I've ended up with two horses today, that are pretty much clones of the two horses I had a decade ago.
Confetti is finally in a place that's similar to her dam when I bought Indy in 2010 (albeit unstarted, but Indy was only really 3/4 started when I bought her).
Lucy turned up on the weekend and is, in colour certainly and the head profile at the right angle, a doppelganger for Scarlett. Same same but different issues/triggers - anxious and overreactive and needs someone to slow life down for her and really be her advocate.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Driving one state over to see horses this weekend. I have a few to see but two really sound/look cool! One is a 4 year old TB, very nice mover. Though other is an Appendix, 4 coming 5 years old. But he's 15 hands (great size for me!) And very cute. Trot isn't super but canter looks nice to my eye. They are doing a lot of hand riding though. It would be interesting to see him on the lunge or ridden differently. I think it looks like a nicer trot is in there.

I'm excited! Horse shopping is tough, it might not pan out. But I'm hopeful but not rushing. And I like meeting new horses anyways.

I'm really paying attention to the type of ride that I'm enjoying and which ones I don't. It takes a little imagination with babies though.

[Ryeissa]

good luck! how exciting

[Kelo]

Good luck with your shopping!

If you want me to look at the appendix's pedigree, just PM me their registered name and I can give you thoughts on their bloodlines.

PS....my Cowpony is 15 hands

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Kelo, okay I will let you know! He might be grade, I didn't ask yet about pedigree but if I like him, I definitely will and will pm you.

I'm 5'2" so 15 hands is a great size for me. Plus I have a 9 year old daughter that likes to come help groom and stuff,so that size makes her feel comfortable.

The TB is supposedly 16 plus hands but unless the rider is very tall, I'm guessing he's 15.3. which isn't bad either.

We will see. I'm feeling excited about the possibilities.

[Anne]

Oh super! Let us know how you get on

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Well, I'm reminded why I don't shop sight unseen! I specifically asked if the main horse I was interested in was a kick ride. I explained I can't do a real/kick ride horse but enjoy that fine middle. Not hot or over reactive, but something that moves when you put your leg on!

Well this horse was a spur ride all the way (they are hunter jumper types.) He's young and I know that's part of it. But feel much of it is who he is. Just not my ride.

But seeing the appendix today! Fingers crossed!

[exvet]

Good luck and keep us posted.

[demi]

Hoping you find a good one!

[StraightForward]

Fingers crossed you like this one!

I think people have wildly different perceptions of temperament. I bought an 3 year old appy sight unseen; the seller said she was high energy "the kind you need to lunge before you ride." Ha. I kept that horse on a strict weekly schedule of jumping and galloping out in the hills just to keep her fit and sharp enough to have a chance of doing training level work.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Straightforward yep! You have to take what people say with a grain of salt lol. That's totally this guy. Needs a lot time outside of the arena.

[blob]

I also think what constitutes as "forward" varies greatly depending on the discipline. And though we aren't galloping off in Dressage, we do typically have a higher standard for forward than many disciplines.

[Chisamba]

you would love Kimba, she is eagerly forward

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Blob, true! Although this guy wasn't forward in anyway ha ha. More like a western pleasure horse! And they are Eventers so I thought they would know but apparently we still have different ideas about forward.

Chisamba, probably!!

Well the cute little appendix horse turned out to be as tense and nervous as he looked in the video. He was nervous with the trainer and I hated how she rode him. She rode him very deep, see-sawing hands. He wasn't through at all, mincing around. I had noticed that in video and in person they always asked for the canter in the corners or short side. Not abnormal for a green horse.

But I found out why. Before I got on she was explaining all the things that would make him spook and spin. Horses in the arena approaching him, donkeys, cars, or just being fresh.

Turns out part of the reason they want him ridden so deeply and only canter towards a wall is because he has some bolt in him. Now I think people have different ideas of bolting. I've heard ppl describe a horse that gets strong as a bolter. To me, bolting is blasting off in a panicked, uncontrolled way.

So anyways I'm riding around trying to get this horse through. He's behind the leg but not in a lazy way. In that nervous, doesn't give you access to their body way. I have the trainer instructing me to go deeper and deeper. I truly loathed it. I got a few decent steps using some leg yields and figure eights but when a horse has been ridden that way, it's difficult to change in one ride.

She tells me to not use much leg in the canter transition and to ask facing a wall. In the history of my riding, I've always been told I'm too quiet, not enough leg, weak leg. So I think okay no worries.

Apparently I did use too much leg because he exploded into canter into a bolt. I am thinking well crap. Thankfully get him stopped and use not an ounce of leg. Get a nice canter depart off my seat, which I did love. But while cantering along I just slightly put my inside calf /upper thigh on for some bend and instantly he panicked, trying to bolt. I just stopped him and told her it wasn't what I wanted.

I did like the responsiveness to the seat for the canter. I didn't like the panic and nervousness. I'm used to riding some hotter and nervous types but this guy just wasn't trust worthy. Too many triggers. So nervous, I think he has a bad start. Poor guy.

So I want something in the middle! Which is what I've said all along. Just confirms it. I had recently rode a horse that was very very sensitive and you had to ride him mostly off the seat and definitely would react to the leg but in a oh is this what you want kind of way not in a panicked scared way I would prefer that. Unfortunately his conformation was poor.

[blob]

Ugh, sorry to hear that LS. Sounds like that horse likely has some pain/mental trauma he needs to sort out. poor guy.

But I agree--a horse sensitive to the seat is great a horse that cannot tolerate leg is not ok.

[Lipsmackerpony88]

Blob, yes I agree. Something going on there. I could see that a little bit in some of the videos but honestly I find it really hard to judge off a video. Sometimes I think one thing and then when I go ride a horse they feel totally different to me. But nope he looked how felt. Poor guy. He definitely needs either a thorough vet workup or to be completely restarted or both!

[Lipsmackerpony88]

And yes a horse reacting to the leg even strongly is okay IMO. But not to panic about the slightest bit of leg. This was panic for sure.

They said he was even more nervous outside (this was indoors) , so I can't imagine what that's like!

Two very opposite horses I saw. I will say in a way the nervous guy was easier for me. But I don't want to deal with that level of nerves.

[Ryeissa]

yeah, huge red flag for sure! Sorry you had to go through that bad experience.